The First Murder

Use this forum to discuss the June 2020 Book of the month, "Killing Abel" by Michael Tieman.
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Tehreem_Khan
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Re: The First Murder

Post by Tehreem_Khan »

Islam doesn't put the sin of eating the fruit on Adam and Eve. Satan is accountable for it as he received them. This was all a plan of God to let the humanity know that they will be deceived into evil again and again and it will be upon their conscience to choose.
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Post by Melisa Jane »

We're naturally born sinful because if the misdeeds of Adam and Eve. No, we can't blame our current sins in the devil because God has given us freewill to choose between the good and the bad.
Insofar as the word 'should' even has meaning, then we must say that the past is exactly as it should be, everything that happened should have happened, and everything that should happen will happen
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Melisa Jane
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Post by Melisa Jane »

Wuoketch wrote: 03 Jun 2020, 09:05 Yes i believe so. According to me, I think it was God's plan so that mankind would be descended onto the earth to fulfill God's will.
Biblically, God knows whatever will happen even before they happen. I agree with you that the fall of man was God's plan.
Insofar as the word 'should' even has meaning, then we must say that the past is exactly as it should be, everything that happened should have happened, and everything that should happen will happen
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Melisa Jane
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Post by Melisa Jane »

Kirsi_78 wrote: 03 Jun 2020, 09:49 That is a very good question. Unfortunately, we'll never know the answer.

And what comes to your second question, I suppose Eve and Adam were not born with original sin, but they used their freedom of choice and as a result, everyone who's come after them is born with original sin. But even with this original sin we still have the freedom to choose what we do and what we don't do... That's what I've reasoned about this difficult topic so far.
Yes, our inborn sins are as a result of the disobedience of Adam and Eve. But through Jesus Christ, the original sins were forgiven. It's now upon an individual to choose between the good and the bad.
Insofar as the word 'should' even has meaning, then we must say that the past is exactly as it should be, everything that happened should have happened, and everything that should happen will happen
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Melisa Jane
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Post by Melisa Jane »

Usuma Khan wrote: 03 Jun 2020, 10:40 The doctrine of original sin means that each human being is born into the world with an inherently selfish nature, and has to learn to love others and to love God. Original sin is a uniquely Christian doctrine. Neither Judaism nor Islam has a doctrine of original sin; in these religions, sin is personal and freely chosen. Each person is therefore responsible only for his or her own sin.
Thanks for elaborating on the issue and educating me about other religious. I'm excited to learn that the original sin is only found in the Christian doctrines.
Insofar as the word 'should' even has meaning, then we must say that the past is exactly as it should be, everything that happened should have happened, and everything that should happen will happen
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Melisa Jane
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Post by Melisa Jane »

Bookreviwer2020 wrote: 03 Jun 2020, 13:21 Yes I agree...each person is responsible for their own sins. The devil merely wispers and encourages people to do bad, but people can choose to ignore that and do good. So we may have influences - religious doctrines ask us to do good and the devil asks is to do bad; but human beings are responsible for themselves and what they do...otherwise it would not be right to punish sinners id they did not choose to win right?
Yes, God has given everyone the power to resist every temptation that the devil may bring. I agree that everyone is responsible for their individual sins.
Insofar as the word 'should' even has meaning, then we must say that the past is exactly as it should be, everything that happened should have happened, and everything that should happen will happen
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Post by Melisa Jane »

J_odoyo wrote: 03 Jun 2020, 13:29 Definitely humanity could have gone a different way, because God didn't create humans to be dominated by evil. And he also didn't create them to be slaves or robots programed to worship him; rather, he gave them the free will chose good or bad. They chose evil, and here we're today.
Are you of the opinion that God didn't know that humanity would choose evil instead of godliness before or when he was creating them?
Insofar as the word 'should' even has meaning, then we must say that the past is exactly as it should be, everything that happened should have happened, and everything that should happen will happen
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Melisa Jane
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Post by Melisa Jane »

ZettieOby wrote: 03 Jun 2020, 16:18 I think God gave us freewill for a purpose. He expects us to do the right thing. I believe humanity would have gone a different way because we will be focused on obeying our Creator and enjoying His fellowship.
Yes. And we would be free from temptations, sin, and all the challenges that we found in this world. We would be the true children if God who obey his command.
Insofar as the word 'should' even has meaning, then we must say that the past is exactly as it should be, everything that happened should have happened, and everything that should happen will happen
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Post by Melisa Jane »

B Creech wrote: 03 Jun 2020, 17:23 I believe if Adam and Eve had never sinned humanity would have definitely gone a different way. Jesus would not have had to come to earth and die for our sins, because I don't believe we would have sinned! I believe the reason we are born with sinful tendencies is because of Adam and Eve sinning. That is just my personal opinion. We do have free will and it is our decision to make. I still tell my children, "Every day when you get up you have one of two choices to make - you can do what is right, or you can do what is wrong. If you choose to take the wrong path, don't blame God for the potholes!"
This is true. Humanity would have taken a completely different path. There would have been no sin, no religion etc. It's the choice of Adam who accepted to be deceived. We perish because of his decision.
Insofar as the word 'should' even has meaning, then we must say that the past is exactly as it should be, everything that happened should have happened, and everything that should happen will happen
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Post by Melisa Jane »

Reubeney wrote: 03 Jun 2020, 17:51 I also think we are born with original sin due to the fall of Adam and Eve in the garden which made the whole human generation sinful. But thanks for the gift of His son who redeems anyone who makes a choice to believe in Him. So I believe it all goes back to the issue of using our own free will to make a decision to believe or not. To do the right or not.
Yes . The Bible says that anyone who believes in Jesus is free from the inherited sinful nature. We are free because of him.
Insofar as the word 'should' even has meaning, then we must say that the past is exactly as it should be, everything that happened should have happened, and everything that should happen will happen
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Post by wendilou49 »

I don't think we can say "the devil made me do it". God gave Adam and Eve a perfect place to live and only made one rule. They were the ones who decided to test Him to see if what He said was true. Eve blamed the serpent; Adam blamed Eve and so it goes. I think if they hadn't sinned, the world could have continued to be perfect...but since we have Freewill, someone eventually would have eaten that fruit and here we would be. God wanted a relationship with us and we were the ones who sinned and made it imperfect.
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Post by J_odoyo »

JM Reviews wrote: 08 Jun 2020, 05:18
J_odoyo wrote: 03 Jun 2020, 13:29 Definitely humanity could have gone a different way, because God didn't create humans to be dominated by evil. And he also didn't create them to be slaves or robots programed to worship him; rather, he gave them the free will chose good or bad. They chose evil, and here we're today.
Are you of the opinion that God didn't know that humanity would choose evil instead of godliness before or when he was creating them?
Not really. Of course God is all knowing. He must have known the fall of man prior and even the Bible affirms that. That's why he had chosen his son, Jesus Christ, before the creation of the Earth, to come and die for humanity—when time was right—for them to be restored back to Him (God). That's why all humanity can only go back to the Father through Jesus Christ.
The more books you read the more choices you have
– Toni Morrison
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Post by Sonya Nicolaidis »

J_odoyo wrote: 03 Jun 2020, 13:29 Definitely humanity could have gone a different way, because God didn't create humans to be dominated by evil. And he also didn't create them to be slaves or robots programed to worship him; rather, he gave them the free will chose good or bad. They chose evil, and here we're today.
I like this answer. Couldn’t have put it better myself! :tiphat:
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Post by Kemmy11 »

Wuoketch wrote: 03 Jun 2020, 09:05 Yes i believe so. According to me, I think it was God's plan so that mankind would be descended onto the earth to fulfill God's will.
I believe so too.
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Post by Kemmy11 »

J_odoyo wrote: 09 Jun 2020, 01:44
JM Reviews wrote: 08 Jun 2020, 05:18
J_odoyo wrote: 03 Jun 2020, 13:29 Definitely humanity could have gone a different way, because God didn't create humans to be dominated by evil. And he also didn't create them to be slaves or robots programed to worship him; rather, he gave them the free will chose good or bad. They chose evil, and here we're today.
Are you of the opinion that God didn't know that humanity would choose evil instead of godliness before or when he was creating them?
Not really. Of course God is all knowing. He must have known the fall of man prior and even the Bible affirms that. That's why he had chosen his son, Jesus Christ, before the creation of the Earth, to come and die for humanity—when time was right—for them to be restored back to Him (God). That's why all humanity can only go back to the Father through Jesus Christ.
Well said. Everything that happened, is happening and will happen are all to God's knowledge. I also think he knew man was going to fall
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