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juliusotieno02 wrote: ↑02 May 2019, 02:55 Having read that book, what do you think of the author? Is he religious? Is he a christian? What do you think the reaction of the church would have been if he is/was a christian?

I believe he "was" a Christian, but something forced him to question his church and then his teachings. If the Church reacted to every single conspiracy in books, then they would force even more scrutiny. I don't think they even care about this book.

If the author is a Christian, I could say that he will be marked as an outcast. Growing up in the church, elders will surely label him as someone evil since his faith about the Scripture has been corrupted. I think of him as someone ultimately curious. But telling people to believe his research about Judas is something I didn't like.

briellejee wrote: ↑12 May 2019, 06:53 If the author is a Christian, I could say that he will be marked as an outcast. Growing up in the church, elders will surely label him as someone evil since his faith about the Scripture has been corrupted. I think of him as someone ultimately curious. But telling people to believe his research about Judas is something I didn't like.

Interesting.

What any of us thinks really doesn't matter. The point is: What's the truth? I tried to present an analysis of NEW material which bears strongly on the answer to that big question. All of what I say can be verified by comparing texts side-by-side. The Betrayal MUST have been taken from the Gnostic story of succession. There is obvious relationship, and it is only a matter of which drew off the other. I am sure I know which. And this being the truth means the Betrayal is not historical, but invention. If it is invented as an inversion of gnostic succession, the Church was trying to hide the successor, James, as traitor, ' Judas.' There is no attestation of either of them in historical accounts independent of the New Testament.

Joytoo97 wrote: ↑08 May 2019, 02:47 As a Christian, I know my facts very well from the scriptures. I believe this author is trying to deviate from the original teachings of Christ.

What 'facts'? These are anonymous writings from long ago with many alterations of lost originals. How can anyone claim they are reliable sources for anything? Comparing texts one to another can yield useful conclusions, and does. It is about the only way we can.

I think the author was the presenting facts how he saw them. I'm not sure Judas betraying or sacrificing himself for Jesus really matters that much to Christians. He doesn't change my belief one way or the other.

oaktreehill wrote: ↑13 May 2019, 18:00 I think the author was the presenting facts how he saw them. I'm not sure Judas betraying or sacrificing himself for Jesus really matters that much to Christians. He doesn't change my belief one way or the other.

There was no Judas or Jesus. They are made up characters. The sacrifice was JAMES sacrificing himself. The early Church needed to get rid of James in a made up story, because Paul killed him. This is told in ACTS SEVEN. 'Stephen' was invention, TOO. READ DR. ROBERT EISENMAN.
Unfortunately this is what evidently really happened. You can believe the Bible or you can believe all the evidence. We never had either The Scrolls or the gnostic texts until just very recently. They tell a VERY different story than Matt., Mark, Luke and John.
Masters come all the time. THAT is what they all say. It isn't just me. I even show where 'Jesus' says it (probably James). John 9:4-5. John 6:40 says one must be able to SEE a savior to be saved.

evraealtana wrote: ↑02 May 2019, 08:50 I don't think that this book in any way harms or changes Christianity as a whole, because I don't think that it has the power to "rock the world" the way the author intended.

Very well said! To be honest, I doubt "The Church" as a whole even knows about this book's existence. Even if they do, it doesn't have enough reach throughout society to affect anything.

bb587 wrote: ↑13 May 2019, 19:23

evraealtana wrote: ↑02 May 2019, 08:50 I don't think that this book in any way harms or changes Christianity as a whole, because I don't think that it has the power to "rock the world" the way the author intended.

Very well said! To be honest, I doubt "The Church" as a whole even knows about this book's existence. Even if they do, it doesn't have enough reach throughout society to affect anything.

I didn't expect it to happen overnight. It took 20 Centuries for Christianity to come this far. If my grandkids see it happen, that would be good. I have .001% of the budget National Geographic had when they screwed up our first chance at getting to the truth. Maybe you could help level the field? I take donations.

evraealtana wrote: ↑02 May 2019, 08:51

Renu G wrote: ↑02 May 2019, 05:34 The author had responded to my comment on LinkedIn by stating that the findings spell the end of Christianity. What nonsense!

This seems somewhat pretentious of him... especially since the book made the argument for a shift in Christian thinking, not the end of it. I cannot believe that what he said was what he actually meant.

I said that? That's interesting. Maybe you could cite it for me. I don't remember calling for the end of anything, but a beginning of circumspection. What Christians all fail to do is to read sources independent of the fold. If you are in a sealed echo-chamber all you will hear is echoes of what you already believe. I know. I was once in it myself.

Renu G wrote: ↑02 May 2019, 06:05

juliusotieno02 wrote: ↑02 May 2019, 05:47

Renu G wrote: ↑02 May 2019, 05:34 The author had responded to my comment on LinkedIn by stating that the findings spell the end of Christianity. What nonsense!

do you think his response rendered his work useless acording to you? What was your opinion after reading the book but before the author's response?

There is a plethora of so called research findings about Judas. They all contradict each other. I won't waste my time with this author's findings. I can go to original sources myself. My faith in Christ is not intellectual. I have experienced Him in my life. The author is very disrespectful to Christians by making claims about the end of Christianity.

Whoever they are you are talking about, they are mistaken on Judas. I am the only one in the world that I know of who has correctly identified Judas as the sacrifice of "the man who bears me" in the amazing Gospel of Judas, the first real PERIOD EVIDENCE on Judas. This is BIG NEWS. BIG, BIG, BIG news. If Judas is the sacrifice, and he is, how can Jesus be in the Gospel story? It would not work as literature. I have looked at this issue more carefully and with more breadth of knowledge of mysticism than anyone in history. Sorry, it is a FACT. I know what I am talking about, because I have seen two Masters myself. ONLY Dr. Robert Eisenman, CSULB Chair Emeritus of the Religious Studies Dept. there, knows that Judas covers James in the New Testament. He doesn't know Masters, as I do. I know, because I personally told him about them, and he scoffed at the idea -- as I assume you also will. rssb [dot] org

B Creech wrote: ↑04 May 2019, 15:44 There is a huge difference in being religious than in being a Christian! I'm no one's judge, but if I had to choose about the author I would say perhaps religious but probably not a Christian. I don't believe the church would be pleased! Without Judas, there would have been no betrayal, but without Jesus, there would be no hope!

Just the opposite. B., the true Master is always living. John 9:4-5 were not spoken to exclude Jesus. In fact the C. Sinaiticus original has "sent US" in 9:4. You would want to SEE your Master, John 6:40, and that is exactly what you can do. rssb [dot] org

Masters are always in the world at any time. Been that way since at least Seth (Genesis 4:26). I have done my homework. We all have to.

bb587 wrote: ↑13 May 2019, 19:23

evraealtana wrote: ↑02 May 2019, 08:50 I don't think that this book in any way harms or changes Christianity as a whole, because I don't think that it has the power to "rock the world" the way the author intended.

Very well said! To be honest, I doubt "The Church" as a whole even knows about this book's existence. Even if they do, it doesn't have enough reach throughout society to affect anything.

if the church were to crack down on books with their own unique interpretation of the Bible, DAN BROWN would have been assassinated.

I don't think the church would take kindly to a real Christian writing something of this nature. I don't think the author is religious.

I don't think the author is a Christian at all , more like he's against it. If he is a Christian, it's a betrayal to the Christian faith and the believers.