Does the book change your religeous beliefs?

Use this forum to discuss the May 2019 Book of the month, "Misreading Judas" by Robert Wahler
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Thundershake
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Re: Does the book change your religeous beliefs?

Post by Thundershake » 16 Jul 2019, 19:56

Kibetious wrote:
01 May 2019, 04:10
No, it does not. No matter how much how Judas may be portrayed I guess, he still remains to be the traitor who ended up committing suicide.
I agree with what you are saying
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Post by [Santiago] » 17 Jul 2019, 12:02

It does not challenge my beliefs. Even though some non-widespread facts about the character are exposed throughout the book, the responsible insight in the motivations behinds the main actions still confirm the settled paradigm of Judas as a traitor. Moreover, only with a thorough bias-detection by the reader can quickly spoil the author's resources for a perspective-shifting effect (considering it might have been incidental), such as framing, language determinism, and logic figures.

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Post by Sahansdal » 17 Jul 2019, 15:40

[Santiago] wrote:
17 Jul 2019, 12:02
It does not challenge my beliefs. Even though some non-widespread facts about the character are exposed throughout the book, the responsible insight in the motivations behinds the main actions still confirm the settled paradigm of Judas as a traitor. Moreover, only with a thorough bias-detection by the reader can quickly spoil the author's resources for a perspective-shifting effect (considering it might have been incidental), such as framing, language determinism, and logic figures.
Setting aside the intrinsic bifurcation in the direction this thread was taking, just what is it you
are trying to say?

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Post by fmd1821 » 18 Jul 2019, 06:34

A short answer to this question is: no, but there a lot more things to consider. Misreading Judas is one of those reads that made me think a lot, not only about religion, but about many other subjects in general. I have not changed my opinion about Judas, but the book has made me think about a character's portrayal and the influence of tradition on his representation. I value this book especially for this reason.

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Post by Sahansdal » 18 Jul 2019, 08:12

fmd1821 wrote:
18 Jul 2019, 06:34
A short answer to this question is: no, but there a lot more things to consider. Misreading Judas is one of those reads that made me think a lot, not only about religion, but about many other subjects in general. I have not changed my opinion about Judas, but the book has made me think about a character's portrayal and the influence of tradition on his representation. I value this book especially for this reason.
Thanks for your comment. Would you consider reviewing on Amazon?

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Post by dorebri2020 » 18 Jul 2019, 09:37

This has not changed my beliefs in the slightest. While I still hold Judas as somewhat a 'traitor', he was only such in God's eyes and plan. Therefore, in my mind, Judas was always a catalyst or instigator more than he was a traitor. Simply put, Jesus had to die. It was merely predestined, and this book has encouraged my belief on such.
"Happiness can be found, even in the darkest of times, if one only remembers to turn on the light."- J.K. Rowling. :D

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Post by Sahansdal » 18 Jul 2019, 09:50

dorebri2020 wrote:
18 Jul 2019, 09:37
This has not changed my beliefs in the slightest. While I still hold Judas as somewhat a 'traitor', he was only such in God's eyes and plan. Therefore, in my mind, Judas was always a catalyst or instigator more than he was a traitor. Simply put, Jesus had to die. It was merely predestined, and this book has encouraged my belief on such.
There is much evidence to the contrary. Other writers of the mythicist persuasion (no historical Jesus) have taken up the impossibility of the Gospels and Acts being history. Richard Carrier and Richard Pervo are two of them. The Mystery of Acts is excellent. Carrier's On the Historicity of Jesus is going to be a standard.
https://www.amazon.com/Mystery-Acts-Unr ... ords=pervo
http://infidels.org/library/modern/rich ... uzzle.html

Judas is pure invention. He never lived. Others say so, not just me. Dr. Robert Eisenman knows. http://csulb.edu/centers/sjco/ His books are a real education just by themselves on how the New Testament cannot be history. He is a Ph.D. in the field.

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Post by Brandy C » 18 Jul 2019, 12:06

Sahansdal wrote:
20 Jun 2019, 17:54
Brandy C wrote:
20 Jun 2019, 11:03
Sahansdal wrote:
12 Jun 2019, 22:00


What if that book is conclusive? You still would believe the Bible is "Holy"?
I believe the question was if the book changed your views. My answer is simple and that answer is still no. I still believe if you're strong in your faith nothing will shake that. I'm not debating one religion over another or which religion is ”right”.
What if you saw the savior in the flesh, the savior for all alive today, would that interest you? I guess not. Seeing would not be believing, right? Petalumaprogram.org
Wow! The way you're presenting your ”point” is the reason many people don't believe. It seems to be your way or no way. You can't make someone believe one way or another by trying to ram it down their throat or bully them! Of course, seeing the Savior would interest me. Seeing is believing but not all of it. We believe in many things we can't visually see.
”You never really understand a person until you consider things from his point of view..Until you climb inside of his skin and walk around in it” Harper Lee, To Kill A Mockingbird

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Post by Sahansdal » 18 Jul 2019, 13:14

Brandy C wrote:
18 Jul 2019, 12:06
Sahansdal wrote:
20 Jun 2019, 17:54
Brandy C wrote:
20 Jun 2019, 11:03


I believe the question was if the book changed your views. My answer is simple and that answer is still no. I still believe if you're strong in your faith nothing will shake that. I'm not debating one religion over another or which religion is ”right”.
What if you saw the savior in the flesh, the savior for all alive today, would that interest you? I guess not. Seeing would not be believing, right? Petalumaprogram.org
Wow! The way you're presenting your ”point” is the reason many people don't believe. It seems to be your way or no way. You can't make someone believe one way or another by trying to ram it down their throat or bully them! Of course, seeing the Savior would interest me. Seeing is believing but not all of it. We believe in many things we can't visually see.
Why do you say I'm bullying? I am not the one who makes the rules! The rule is, has always been, will always be, that a living Master is necessary to obtain permanent release from lower worlds, like this one. Salvation is not saved from death, but saved from rebirth. You won't find that in the church version. But it is everywhere in any master's teachings. You who cleave to the Church's Christ teachings have been misled, on purpose back in the beginning, now probably just through ignorance of the current church leaders.

The Christian teachings happen to be the only ones that I know of which are conceived as disinformation. Other religions are not. Purposeful deception such as this is unforgivable. We KNOW they are false from new discoveries of THE ORIGINAL stories.

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Post by Sahansdal » 18 Jul 2019, 13:20

Brandy C wrote:
18 Jul 2019, 12:06
Sahansdal wrote:
20 Jun 2019, 17:54
Brandy C wrote:
20 Jun 2019, 11:03


I believe the question was if the book changed your views. My answer is simple and that answer is still no. I still believe if you're strong in your faith nothing will shake that. I'm not debating one religion over another or which religion is ”right”.
What if you saw the savior in the flesh, the savior for all alive today, would that interest you? I guess not. Seeing would not be believing, right? Petalumaprogram.org
Wow! The way you're presenting your ”point” is the reason many people don't believe. It seems to be your way or no way. You can't make someone believe one way or another by trying to ram it down their throat or bully them! Of course, seeing the Savior would interest me. Seeing is believing but not all of it. We believe in many things we can't visually see.
Why does everyone act so defensively? I don't make the rules! I'm only the messenger. I'm trying my best, in a labor of love, since there is no money in this, to fill people in on things THEY CAN CHECK THEMSELVES.

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Post by Kemunto lucy » 19 Jul 2019, 14:10

I always have an open mind to many things but my religious beliefs are firm. This book can't in any way change that. Judas was disloyal and these are just excuses for his betrayal.

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Post by Sahansdal » 19 Jul 2019, 14:40

Kemunto lucy wrote:
19 Jul 2019, 14:10
I always have an open mind to many things but my religious beliefs are firm. This book can't in any way change that. Judas was disloyal and these are just excuses for his betrayal.
This is not history. It is literature! You should read the mythicists before looking at the New Testament again.
Pervo:https://www.amazon.com/Mystery-Acts-Unr ... ords=pervo
Carrier:http://richardcarrier.blogspot.com/2011 ... s.html?m=1
Eisenman:http://roberteisenman.com/

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Post by SA2090 » 20 Jul 2019, 13:08

Everyone has their own set of views and those can be read and respected, which was my perspective about the book. I did not need to necessarily believe in the views.

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Post by Sahansdal » 20 Jul 2019, 19:06

SA2090 wrote:
20 Jul 2019, 13:08
Everyone has their own set of views and those can be read and respected, which was my perspective about the book. I did not need to necessarily believe in the views.
I don't know how many stars you might give me, but I do need reviews. :)
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/15246 ... 5K32J6D6Y1

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Post by Brandy C » 20 Jul 2019, 21:47

Sahansdal wrote:
18 Jul 2019, 13:14
Brandy C wrote:
18 Jul 2019, 12:06
Sahansdal wrote:
20 Jun 2019, 17:54

What if you saw the savior in the flesh, the savior for all alive today, would that interest you? I guess not. Seeing would not be believing, right? Petalumaprogram.org
Wow! The way you're presenting your ”point” is the reason many people don't believe. It seems to be your way or no way. You can't make someone believe one way or another by trying to ram it down their throat or bully them! Of course, seeing the Savior would interest me. Seeing is believing but not all of it. We believe in many things we can't visually see.
Why do you say I'm bullying? I am not the one who makes the rules! The rule is, has always been, will always be, that a living Master is necessary to obtain permanent release from lower worlds, like this one. Salvation is not saved from death but saved from rebirth. You won't find that in the church version. But it is everywhere in any master's teachings. You who cleave to the Church's Christ teachings have been misled, on purpose back in the beginning, now probably just through ignorance of the current church leaders.

The Christian teachings happen to be the only ones that I know of which are conceived as disinformation. Other religions are not. Purposeful deception such as this is unforgivable. We KNOW they are false from new discoveries of THE ORIGINAL stories.
Again the question was if the book changed your views? Once again I'm saying no. Like I stated before, I'm not arguing one religion over another or saying who is wrong or right. Yes, I personally feel the way you're presenting your side is intense. You know nothing about me or my religion. I don't cleave to the Church’s teachings. I'm not entirely in one camp or another. My personal beliefs are a combination of many things. I don't feel like I have to justify my beliefs or those reasons. We can agree to disagree because we all are entitled to our opinions.
”You never really understand a person until you consider things from his point of view..Until you climb inside of his skin and walk around in it” Harper Lee, To Kill A Mockingbird

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